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CoxRox, good to hear from you again!
Regarding Jesus and good works:
You must remember that Jesus Himself was one of the biggest proponents of the idea that works flows from the nature of a person. Remember, He taught that fruit always matched the nature of the tree. A good tree bears good fruit, and a bad tree bears bad fruit.
So the type of tree determines the type of fruit. This is the opposite from saying that the type of fruit determines the type of tree.
In other words, in no sense was Jesus saying that you could change into whatever type of tree you wanted to be by striving to bear that kind of fruit. Ie, you can't "become" a good tree by producing good fruit. No, you have to be a good tree to begin with or good fruit will not be produced.
This, coupled with the fact that we know Jesus taught that each and every person is of such a nature that they need to be born again (John 3) proves to me that Jesus does not put much confidence in the fallen nature of man. To Jesus, each and every person is of such a nature that by default that they "must be born again".
Non-born again person = bad tree
Born again person = good tree
As far as the judgment is concerned, we will most surely be judged according to our works. The question is, does Jesus stand in for the Christian when God considers their works? Yes or no? If no, then what int he world did Jesus come to earth and die on the cross for? I thought He was my substitute from beginning to end? I thought He was my mediator with the Father?
When I stand before God, I don't want him to see my works, even my "good" works, as they are "filthy rags" and judge me on that basis. I want Jesus to step in and take my place.
So when God judges non-Christians, of course, nobody is there to take their place as they do not trust in Jesus Christ as their substitute, so they will be judged according to their works.
Quote Also, does it matter if we believe that 'everyone' has an 'equal opportunity' to be partakers of Jesus' sacrifice (many are called but few chosen)? Most 'churches' seem to be of this viewpoint. Would you consider them 'christians'?
Yes, they are still Christians.
First, why does belief in this doctrine not matter? It doesn't matter in a sense because this doctrine is not an essential doctrine. What I mean is, there are certain doctrines that are considered "essential" that if one does not adhere to them they are outside of the pale of orthodoxy. Even outside the realm of Christianity. Some examples of essential doctrines are: The Trinity, The Deity of Christ, the Sinlessness of Christ, the sinfulness of man, etc, salvation by faith alone in Christ alone by grace alone. If someone denies any of these there is no way they can be what the Bible calls Christian. They are denying the very foundations of the entire gospel message. So yes, a person can be a Christian still if they deny the soteriology of "Calvinism", because it's not an essential doctrine, though it is a helpful and (I believe) fully Biblical doctrine.
Second, why does it matter? It matters because what we believe affects our worldview. It also affects how we conduct ourselves and our motives for our actions. For example, as a Calvinist, I spread the gospel knowing that God has His elect people out there that He desires to save and He uses me as the tool in His hands to reach all of His people. So I have fellow brothers and sisters of God out there that I am motivated to find so that they can hear the good news of their salvation (See John 11:51-52, and 2 Ti 2:10)
Joh 11:51-52
(51) And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;
(52) And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.
2Ti 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
These verses make it clear to me that part of Christ's goal for dying was to "gather together all of the children of God". Paul echoes this same mentality when he says he "endures all things for the sake of the elect so that they may be saved". Notice, the salvation of the elect is Paul's motivation. Consider Paul's life. He had one of the hardest lives as a Christian, full of persecution, beatings, imprisonment, running for his life, etc. And all of that, Paul says he endures for God's elect.
That's just one example of many regarding how our view of salvation affects how we think and act, and our motives. Whereas the Arminian really doesn't have these same motives does he? His goal is really to emotionally manipulate as many people as possible into making some kind of positive decision for Christ. It all depends on his presentation doesn't it? To them, there's no such thing as God's elect who will most assuredly respond positively. It's all up in the air and they have their fingers crossed whether or not their efforts will be in vain. Whereas the Calvinist knows for a fact that his efforts are not in vain because there is a 100% guarantee that the gospel will accomplish everything it was meant to do.
Quote I've been googling churches in my area and I've found a Zion Baptist Church, who are 'Calvinist'. I've always viewed this church with great suspicion (it's a wierd shape) and wondered what strange breed of christians has their home there. Now I know. I might check them out. They don't seem to have any 'outreach' programmes, unlike all the mainstream evangelical churches who have homeless projects, street preaching, etc etc. I live in central England, so I'm not sure what's 'out there' really. If I were to compare 'churches' I would assume that the ones 'doing' stuff were more in line with Jesus' words in Matt 25 and these 'churches' are 'Arminian'.
That sounds like a mighty weird church my friend. You musn't paint everyone with the same brush. If church A is acting a certain way that doesn't mean it is the norm or that church B will also act that way. If what you say is true that that church doesn't do the things the Bible commands us to do, then my question is, is it really a church at all?
Quote That could be me though. Maybe I'm not one of the elect: I might be one of the ones 'called' but not chosen. I feel like that most of the time.
The only question that matters is: Do you believe in Jesus? Do you trust him alone for your salvation putting no confidence in yourself, your flesh, your efforts, etc. Do you believe in Jesus?
That's the gospel message isn't it?
The Bible tells us how we can know if we are Christians. And you know what, never, not even once does it tell us that we have to stop to check to see if we "feel" like we are a Christian. Our feelings on the matter are irrelevant. They are subjective. The only thing the Bible is concerned with is: Do you believe in Jesus? And does your life reflect your belief in Jesus? Ie, are you a changed person? A "new creature"? End of story!
Quote John 3:16 It doesn't say 'God loved the elect...'. 1 John 2:2 I'd understood Paul to be referring to 'gentiles' here, not just 'Jews'.
I don't understand your concern over John 3:16. John 3:16 doesn't offer anything that is a denial of the Calvinistic understand, nor does it offer anything that gives strength to the Arminian understanding.
The verse simply teaches that everyone who believes in Jesus will be saved. Both Calvinism and Arminianism affirm that, so what's the problem?
I will however like to point out something to you. The word "so" in the Greek means "in this manner". You can see the same word in Acts 14:1 where it says "they so spake...". In other words, "they spake in such a way..." or "in such a manner". So the word "so" in John 3:16 doesn't mean that God SOOOOOOOO loved the world, sort of like how a teenager would tell you how they love their boyfriend/girlfriend "sooooo much". So John 3:16 isn't saying that God "intensely" loved the world, but rather, "here is how God loved the world", or "God loved the world in this manner:". In what manner? He sent His only begotten Son to save people. To save who? Everyone? No, only only all who believe. (everyone who believes/whoever believes)
Paraphrase: God demonstrated his love towards the world in this way: He sent His Son to save believers.
Regarding 1 John 2:2, I am in agreement with you. I believe John is saying that Christ died for Gentiles as well as Jews, thus, John employs the term "the whole world". (Saying "the world" or "the whole world" was a very common way for Jews to refer to the other nations of the world)
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